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Post by el Gusano on Apr 17, 2007 23:35:11 GMT -5
It may be up to six by now.
Beatings "send a message" so much better.
Based on some of the info, perhaps we should ban Koreans.
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Post by tcrashfx on Apr 18, 2007 3:23:49 GMT -5
And college students.
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Felix
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Post by Felix on Apr 18, 2007 8:20:53 GMT -5
At the risk of threadjacking from the dominant "gun control, pro and con" direction this thread has taken, the most moving comment I heard in the past two days of coverage came from the mother of a survivor who is coming home for a few days: I just want my son here where I can hug him as much as I want; at least for a few days. For me, that touches the core of this event and why it is important. All the rest is the usual crossfire from competing bunkered-down zealots expressing various political dogmas.
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Post by tcrashfx on Apr 18, 2007 8:58:21 GMT -5
Compassion for the victims.
Responsibility on the shooter.
In that order.
True evil intentions cannot be foreseen, but we should equip people with the tools, the ability and the mental fortitude to deal with evil when it manifests itself in our midst. To immediately and effectively render the threat harmless by whatever means are at hand.
We have have become a nation of victims and potential victims who expect others (The Guv'mint) to protect us from all evil (And all other bad things), in advance. I am not sure where this, "I am incapable of fending for myself nor should I have to be aware of things happening around me 'cause that is someone else's job syndrome" came from.
But that is the core of the problem.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2007 9:09:45 GMT -5
I agree, but how do you explain to campus authorities why you're carrying heat - and expect to be allowed to remain a student?
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Post by tcrashfx on Apr 18, 2007 9:18:21 GMT -5
And I wonder how much trouble would such a student or faculty member be in?
One who illegally carried a weapon on to the University Campus and then "rendered harmless" the shooter, after his first shot, be in after the fact?
Presidential pardon and an award, maybe?
Yea, two wrongs can make a right. At least in this case.
Or we could assign each student/faculty member their own personal cop 24/7? That would make every campus safer. If this program works we could do it for every US citizen (Illegal immigrants would be exempt from this policy).
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kroisis
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Post by kroisis on Apr 18, 2007 9:24:04 GMT -5
Have they already got the ballistics proof back that the killer did in fact commit suicide?
Seems awfully quick of them....but then given the world wide attention lighting the fire.
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Post by daworm on Apr 18, 2007 10:43:39 GMT -5
Then why mention it? Why bother to point out he had a legally obtained gun unless you wanted to make a point that it shouldn't be easy, or even possible, to obtain one? If that wasn't your intention, fine. Someone else would have made that assertion, and the rebuttal applies equally to all comers.
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Post by legaltender on Apr 18, 2007 10:58:34 GMT -5
You want to pivot off that statement in a gun control discussion, be my guest.
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Post by legaltender on Apr 18, 2007 11:04:27 GMT -5
Back to the investigation:
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Post by el Gusano on Apr 18, 2007 14:42:03 GMT -5
I ask the question: Why was this student not banned?
Why are psychos not put on the FBI list alongside criminals who cannot purchase firearms?
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Post by tcrashfx on Apr 18, 2007 15:18:50 GMT -5
They are. There is a question on the ATF form, "Are you mentally ill or have you ever been diagnosed with a mental illness?" Circle "Yes" or "No". Reckon which one dude circled before he got is weapons?
There is no way to verify these answers as psychiatric records are protected by confidentiality.
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Kordax
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Post by Kordax on Apr 18, 2007 18:19:38 GMT -5
chronicle.com/free/2007/04/2007041810n.htmIn Sniper in the Tower I concluded, and later the FBI's premier profiler, John Douglas, in his book Anatomy of Motive would agree, that "[Whitman's] actions speak for themselves." Any cause-and-effect theory, whether organic (brain tumor), chemical (amphetamine psychosis), or psychological (military training or child abuse), embracing the idea that Charles Whitman's judgment or free will was impaired, is not consistent with what he did. He carefully planned every move and detail, and he succeeded in doing what he set out to do -- murdering people and getting himself killed in spectacular fashion. The Whitman case taught me that sometimes our zeal to champion causes important to us or to explain the unexplainable and be "enlightened" blinds us to the obvious.
Charles Whitman was a murderer; he killed innocent people. We should not forget that. In Virginia we appear to have a Whitman-like character. It is vitally important for all to remember that there is only one person responsible for what happened in Blacksburg, and that is the man who pulled the trigger. But in Virginia the diversions have already begun. As I write this, less than a half-day since the senseless killing of nearly three dozen innocent people, Web headlines on CNN, Fox, and MSNBC read: "Did Virginia Tech's Response Cost Lives?" "Parents Demand Firing of Virginia Tech President, Police Chief Over Handling," "Students Wonder About Police Response." Ironically, those headlines are juxtaposed with pictures of law-enforcement officers administering medical treatment and hauling wounded students to safety. Next to those pictures are videos of Virginia Tech's president and chief of police, in pain and in the midst of a nightmare, bombarded with sensational questions from irresponsible reporters.
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Post by daworm on Apr 18, 2007 22:20:01 GMT -5
I just shed a tear...
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Felix
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Post by Felix on Apr 19, 2007 8:49:08 GMT -5
One of many interviews I heard over the past few days was a telephone interview with Nikki Giovanni. Giovanni is a black poet, born in Knoxville, who is a professor of English at Virgina Tech. She had encountered the shooter in a class and, like almost everyone else interviewed who had met the guy said he was apparently disturbed.
Giovanni was terse with the interviewer, declining to ponitificate further on the matter. She did say she was unsurprised. Sounds familiar.
Obviously the sheer mass of media and the limitless need for copy makes for a feeding frenzy when something like this happens. Giovanni, like any good poet, used her words economically, without the padding the interviewer prompter her to supply.
As tcrash said, the concerns here should be two:
Comfort and empathize with the bereaved.
Acknowledge that the shooter is responsible for his act.
Period.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2007 9:00:11 GMT -5
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Post by tcrashfx on Apr 19, 2007 10:46:20 GMT -5
Psychiatrist: Showing Cho's Video Is 'Social Catastrophe' April 19, 2007 — The videos of Seung-hui Cho, the man who fatally shot 32 people at Virginia Tech on Monday and then killed himself, shouldn't have been released because they don't offer the public any greater understanding of the gruesome crime, said Michael Welner, a forensic psychiatrist and ABC News consultant, on "Good Morning America" today. "If anybody cares about the victims in Blacksburg and if anybody cares about their children, stop showing this video now. Take it off the Internet. Let it be relegated to YouTube," Welner said. "This is a social catastrophe. Showing the video is a social catastrophe." During a pause in his killing spree Monday, Cho sent a package that included 43 photos, video clips and a letter to NBC. NBC received the package Wednesday. The videos included Cho's rants on the reasoning behind the crimes he was presumably about to commit. The airing of these "Videos/Material" from the predator are OBSCENE!
What better way to convince every remaining psycho that their manifesto and their "reasoning" for their evil deeds will be broadcast and glorified by the national mainstream media, if they just go out and express themselves by randomly murdering some innocent people?
Thank you, MEDIA (Read: spokesmen, PR men and spin doctors for the criminally insane).
Get ready for some copy-cats.
ATTN: All psychopathic mass murderers, most national media outlets will get your twisted side of the story out for ya!
For free, even!
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Post by daworm on Apr 19, 2007 13:00:36 GMT -5
Surely no one is seriously expecting the media to behave responsibly, are they?
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Post by tcrashfx on Apr 20, 2007 3:15:34 GMT -5
Surely no one is seriously expecting the media to behave responsibly, are they? I expect it, I just don't hold my breath expecting it.
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Post by tcrashfx on Apr 20, 2007 3:53:37 GMT -5
by DANIEL MAROTTA April 19, 2007 — The media frenzy at the Virginia Tech campus in Blacksburg, Va., has spurred resentment among family and friends who continue to mourn for the victims of Monday's shooting. Anti-media signs have been spotted around the campus as the relationship between the community and the media becomes increasingly strained.Students have also been handing out a flier that reads: "We are Hokie Nation and we need to mourn and heal. We need each other. The media has taken advantage of our situation and are exploiting us for their own sensationalism. We will not tolerate the abuse; we love our community far too much to stand for this any more. "We, the students of Virginia Tech, are asserting ourselves. We are taking back our campus. All media, if they have any respect for Hokie Nation, will no longer attack our administration. They will no longer hound our students. Leave us to heal. Leave us to ourselves. Hokie Nation needs to be UNITED. Return our campus to us."
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2007 9:04:55 GMT -5
> Surely no one is seriously expecting the media to behave responsibly, are they?
Define 'responsibly'.
Define the universe. Give three examples.
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Post by tcrashfx on Apr 20, 2007 18:59:23 GMT -5
Not acting like an ass hat?
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