Which concerns you more?

[joedog]

Jul 19, 2010 20:02:30 GMT -5 @yodanbr2 said:

Which causes you more concern / who would you rather not face?

You left out politicians.

[Bob]

No joe he said "rather not face" politicians are all smiles to your face, you just don't want to turn your back to them...

[LimitedRecourse]

Problems you may have with law enforcement are more immediate, but you would at least be able to report the officer to someone who could actually DO something to the officer and to correct the situation.

If you have issues with lawyers, and particularly with judges, you have noone to report them to who can do ANYTHING except "censure" a lawyer. Judges are EXEMPT from any type of prosecution for screwing up your case.

[professorx]

Jul 19, 2010 20:02:30 GMT -5 @yodanbr2 said:

Which causes you more concern / who would you rather not face?

At the 1rst stage, the police stage, you still have a chance. If it gets to the "lawyers and judges" phase, you are screwed.

[JC]

Cops and lawyers don't bother me a bit.
Judges on the other hand are sacks of shit

[Jay]

If you have a problem with a cop related issue, it seems most cops end up saying to just take it up w/ the judge... And most judges automatically side w/ cops...

And since many politicians are lawyers, it's hard to trust any of 'em...

[ScarlettP]

I have never had a bad experience with a police officer. Mind you, I normally am a law abiding citizen with no reason for cops to bother me. When I do have to deal with them, I'm polite and cooperative and they treat me with respect. LAWYERS on the other hand, in my experience, are nothing but greedy, money hungry sharks who don't give a crap about what the truth is. They just want to spin any situation to a point where THEY get PAID. Judges always seem to be trapped by procedures and what they are legally allowed to hear and look at. Most seem to actually want to do what's right, but often seem to get tied up in more red tape than a Christmas package.

[Tsavodiner]

Are you single?

[Warkitty]

Those lawyers are just being capitalists. I thought that was the Great American Way?

[LimitedRecourse]

The Great American Way is to make money by working at an honest job and doing your best to better yourself by the opportunities presented to you. Preying on people at their most vulnerable times or twisting facts/lying to get a POS out of their deserved punishment is nowhere close.

[Warkitty]

It's Capitalism, LR. Make money. That's what Capitalism is all about and that's our primary institution. Capitalism doesn't take morals into account, it's about making a buck.

[Justin Thyme]

twisting facts/lying to get a POS out of their deserved punishment is nowhere close.

Everyone, even the POS, has a right to a vigorous defense. If the lawyer does actually lie then prove it and have him disbarred and prosecuted for that act. Otherwise collect the evidence needed to convict the POS in a way that will stand up to the scrutiny of any lawyer. I don't want to see anyone convicted on evidence flimsy enough to raise reasonable doubt.

[LimitedRecourse]

"...then prove it and have him disbarred and prosecuted for that act."

He might even get "censured" or something.

[TNBear]

Only if he steals money from another lawyer.

[daworm]

It's Capitalism, LR. Make money. That's what Capitalism is all about and that's our primary institution. Capitalism doesn't take morals into account, it's about making a buck.

Since when is this? Capitalism involves making money, but that isn't incompatible with morals.

[professorx]

Jul 22, 2010 13:28:17 GMT -5 Justin Thyme said:

twisting facts/lying to get a POS out of their deserved punishment is nowhere close.

Everyone, even the POS, has a right to a vigorous defense.

This line is always quoted by lawyers to justify the money they earn by deception. The term was probably coined by mob lawyers. They should argue a actual defense rather than drag in "twinkies", improbable conspiracies, or to drag the victim(s) though the mud. The intent is supposed to be justice, not winning at any cost (this goes for both sides). The profession needs more morals and ethics.

The option of becoming a multi-millionare due to manipulating the legal system should be eliminated.

The way juries are picked should be reformed. For example, it should be composed of people who never read or watch the news. How qualified could people like that be?

[ScarlettP]

And why do ambulance chasers advertise that they can "get you all the money you deserve"? Because they will vigorously fight to get you a huge settlement. Then they take 1/3 to 1/2 of that settlement off the top. The bigger the settlement, the larger the check for the lawyer. Good luck getting your half.

Now, if you have been wrongfully accused, good luck finding a defense lawyer. There is no money to be made defending the average Joe. You will notice that even the TV lawyers who work so hard only work for extremely wealthy people and their fees are never discussed. (Except for Matlock who always made a jokes about how high his fees were.)

[Jay]

There are always public defenders, 'eh?..

[gridbug]

Jul 22, 2010 23:13:30 GMT -5 daworm said:

It's Capitalism, LR. Make money. That's what Capitalism is all about and that's our primary institution. Capitalism doesn't take morals into account, it's about making a buck.

Since when is this? Capitalism involves making money, but that isn't incompatible with morals.

And I thought I tended to get too idealistic!

[daworm]

And I thought I was a cynic...

[Jay]

Surely, there are people out there who sell stuff and have a bit of morals..

[Warkitty]

Morals are not REQUIRED for Capitalism.

[LimitedRecourse]

But that doesn't mean that all capitalists are immoral.

[Warkitty]

No one said they were, I merely pointed out that Lawyers are Capitalists, and since Capitalism is the method of choice for America, Lawyers are very American regardless your complaint about how they make their money.

[LimitedRecourse]

And I reject the premise that true capitalism is without morals.

[Warkitty]

Show me where Morals are involved in the definition.

Capitalism definition

An economic system based on a free market, open competition, profit motive and private ownership of the means of production. Capitalism encourages private investment and business, compared to a government-controlled economy. Investors in these private companies (i.e. shareholders) also own the firms and are known as capitalists.

Investopedia Commentary

In such a system, individuals and firms have the right to own and use wealth to earn income and to sell and purchase labor for wages with little or no government control. The function of regulating the economy is then achieved mainly through the operation of market forces where prices and profit dictate where and how resources are used and allocated. The U.S. is a capitalistic system.


From what I see, morals are not part of the requirements or equation. Reject that idea all you want but by doing so you reject true capitalism.

[TNBear]

Waiting for a witty response to that one LR.

[daworm]

Morals are no more a requirement for being a capitalist than for being a member of any other economic system. You don't need morals to be a socialist or a fascist or anything else.

[JC]

Lawyers make money by helping us out of messes that we get ourselves into.
Lawyers also make money by helping us take action on those who have wronged us.
I see no problems or moral quandaries with the way the 'system' is set up for that.

I do, however, see major problems with people loosing money when they have done nothing wrong. See the Craft case for instance.
But, the lawyers helping the innocent are still entitled to a pay check... and they are also entitled to a paycheck when the innocent sues the accuser.
I also see no problems with that.

[Justin Thyme]

Capitalism is an economic system. Economic systems do not take morality into consideration. All economic systems, even communism, are amoral. Morality is defined elsewhere.