What government healthcare gets you

[el Gusano]

Teen With Tonsillitis Dies After Being Misdiagnosed With H1N1

A 16-year-old girl died after being misdiagnosed with the H1N1 virus, when she really had tonsillitis, London’s Daily Mail reported.

Charlotte Hartey’s condition was diagnosed over the phone, like many other H1N1 viruses in the United Kingdom, but when complications arose from Charlotte’s real affliction – tonsillitis – the teenager died.

[nic]

Fox news reporting on a Daily Mail Story. No bias here, no sir.

But lets tidy up the story. The girl never visited a doctor but phoned a helpline. A helpline set up specifically for H1N1. It seems like she was describing the correct symptoms for flu, and was prescribed something that would cure flu-like symptoms.

Perhaps the helpline should have sent the patient to a Doctor. It is a sad story, and a mistake that should have been avoided.

In the UK, it seems H1N1 has hit pretty bad, and demand is outgrowing supply. (There were 25,000 cases of H1N1 in England last week) It seems that the government are doing all they can to relieve the situation.

The Health Secretary for England, Andy Burnham, said, last week:

"The UK will be one of the first countries in the world to receive a vaccine supply, thanks to contracts put in place by the Government in advance of the pandemic."

So, I think overall, the Government are doing pretty well.

I mean, its not liek we can't do a quick Google search and fine many cases of Misdiagnosis in the US, or even in the Tennessee Valley area.

[gridbug]

Don't bother him with facts, you socialist!

You can't beat medical care here in the US! Chant proudly all Americans - We're Number 37!! We're Number 37!!

[Felix]

Ah, thanks, Gridbug, I needed a really good laugh this morning.

[BlackFox]

We better fix health care quick so we can set up a way to help the people who need it most before the Jesus freaks take back over.

Wait, what?

[el Gusano]

Aug 18, 2009 4:55:56 GMT -5 nic said:

Perhaps the helpline should have sent the patient to a Doctor.

Here, for the moment, if we, as individuals decide to go see a doctor, guess what? We can do so.

If we, as individuals decide not to, too bad.

But the choice is ours.

[Justin Thyme]

Non-Fox news report on GB's NHS.

Former nurse is forced to sell her home after forking out £100,000 on treatment abroad because of NHS shortfalls
Last updated at 16:22pm on 13.05.08

A former nurse with a life-threatening heart condition is selling her home after forking out nearly £100,000 on treatment abroad because of shortfalls in NHS care.

Joan Botten, 64, spent £70,000 having two pacemakers fitted in Monaco to avoid the seven-month wait at her local hospital.

She then forked out £20,000 for two courses of revolutionary stem cell treatment in Germany which has dramatically improved her health but is not approved for use in Britain.

Now she is being forced to sell her £235,000 home for a third course of the treatment after her local PCT turned down her latest plea for funding.

Doctors say the treatment is her only hope as current UK-approved drugs can only "maintain" the decline in her health, but not improve it.

(Continued)

---

I thought the NHS was brought into being to keep people from losing their homes because of medical necessities.

[printemps]

She then forked out £20,000 for two courses of revolutionary stem cell treatment in Germany which has dramatically improved her health but is not approved for use in Britain.

Insurers pay out for stem cell-based cardiac therapy in this country?

I wouldn't leap to that conclusion.

[Justin Thyme]

Aug 18, 2009 17:08:13 GMT -5 printemps said:

She then forked out £20,000 for two courses of revolutionary stem cell treatment in Germany which has dramatically improved her health but is not approved for use in Britain.

Insurers pay out for stem cell-based cardiac therapy in this country?

I wouldn't leap to that conclusion.

That one doesn't impress you? How about this one?

Overhauling health-care system tops agenda at annual meeting of Canada's doctors
Aug 15 11:28 AM US/Eastern

Jennifer Graham, THE CANADIAN PRESS SASKATOON - The incoming president of the Canadian Medical Association says this country's health-care system is sick and doctors need to develop a plan to cure it.

Dr. Anne Doig says patients are getting less than optimal care and she adds that physicians from across the country - who will gather in Saskatoon on Sunday for their annual meeting - recognize that changes must be made.

"We all agree that the system is imploding, we all agree that things are more precarious than perhaps Canadians realize," Doing said in an interview with The Canadian Press.

"We know that there must be change," she said. "We're all running flat out, we're all just trying to stay ahead of the immediate day-to-day demands."

The pitch for change at the conference is to start with a presentation from Dr. Robert Ouellet, the current president of the CMA, who has said there's a critical need to make Canada's health-care system patient-centred. He will present details from his fact-finding trip to Europe in January, where he met with health groups in England, Denmark, Belgium, Netherlands and France.

His thoughts on the issue are already clear. Ouellet has been saying since his return that "a health-care revolution has passed us by," that it's possible to make wait lists disappear while maintaining universal coverage and "that competition should be welcomed, not feared."

In other words, Ouellet believes there could be a role for private health-care delivery within the public system.

He has also said the Canadian system could be restructured to focus on patients if hospitals and other health-care institutions received funding based on the patients they treat, instead of an annual, lump- sum budget. This "activity-based funding" would be an incentive to provide more efficient care, he has said.

(Continued)

---

May be things aren't so rosy north of the border as our neighbors think.

[el Gusano]

She should have just taken a pill.

[Scarlet&Gray]

Now she is being forced to sell her £235,000 home for a third course of the treatment after her local PCT turned down her latest plea for funding.

She shouldn't have bought such an expensive home to start with. She should come to America and get free medical care. Just show up to the ER. Don't worry us responsible people who pay for insurance will pick up the tab with the constant rate increases we get because of the uninsured. But it's America we have the best health care in the world.

[Scarlet&Gray]

I stand corrected according to the WHO we rank at 37.

1 France
2 Italy
3 San Marino
4 Andorra
5 Malta
6 Singapore
7 Spain
8 Oman
9 Austria
10 Japan
11 Norway
12 Portugal
13 Monaco
14 Greece
15 Iceland
16 Luxembourg
17 Netherlands
18 United Kingdom
19 Ireland
20 Switzerland
21 Belgium
22 Colombia
23 Sweden
24 Cyprus
25 Germany
26 Saudi Arabia
27 United Arab Emirates
28 Israel
29 Morocco
30 Canada
31 Finland
32 Australia
33 Chile
34 Denmark
35 Dominica
36 Costa Rica
37 United States

[nic]

Aug 18, 2009 14:39:43 GMT -5 Justin Thyme said:

Non-Fox news report on GB's NHS.

Former nurse is forced to sell her home after forking out £100,000 on treatment abroad because of NHS shortfalls
Last updated at 16:22pm on 13.05.08

I thought the NHS was brought into being to keep people from losing their homes because of medical necessities.

I'm not sure that was the primary reason the NHS was set up. I think it was more of a greatest good, for the greatest people. Sure, I know people who have had to pay money (Back home) to visit a Doctor in The Netherlands, or Germany, or even The US, thats the way it is. You want something above and beyond the regular, you have to pay for it.

I don't want to say that the NHS is perfect. I don't even want the US to adopt the UK system. But, I also know I teach kids in the area who are sick, and can't learn anything at school, because the family can't afford a trip to the Doctors, or the associated medicines.

Greatest number, Greatest care.

[Justin Thyme]

But, I also know I teach kids in the area who are sick, and can't learn anything at school, because the family can't afford a trip to the Doctors, or the associated medicines.

I think I heard you mention you live in Georgia. Do you also teach there? If so are these sick children's parents not aware of PeachCare? I know there are free clinics set up in every almost every county that offer free basic medical services to people who qualify. Usually the qualification is making no more than 200% of poverty level for that household.

Basic health care is available for everyone in the US right now through existing government programs or existing private programs. There is no reason at all for your sick kids not seeing a doctor. Tell me what state and county you are talking about and I'll find the services for you.

[el Gusano]

Aug 19, 2009 7:14:30 GMT -5 Justin Thyme said:

Basic health care is available for everyone in the US right now through existing government programs or existing private programs. There is no reason at all for your sick kids not seeing a doctor. Tell me what state and county you are talking about and I'll find the services for you.

Quit trying to protect individual freedoms you capitalist pig!

I wonder if these poor, poor people have cable TV, eat out, etc.?

Or do they sit home and watch the grass grow, throw rocks at each other (I'm sure they can't afford balls), and have nothing but homegrown beans to eat and water to drink?

[Scarlet&Gray]

Here's your chance to be heard.

President Obama is holding a live strategy meeting on Thursday at 2:30 p.m. Eastern Time for all Organizing for America supporters. I hope you can join us, online or by phone.

The President will update us on the fight to pass real health insurance reform -- what's happening in D.C. and what's happening around the country. He'll lay out our strategy and message going forward and answer questions from supporters like you. And we'll unveil the next actions we'll organize together.

This is a critical time in this President's administration, and in the history of our country. I hope you can join us.

Here are the details:

What: Organizing for America National Health Care Forum

When: Thursday, August 20th, 2:30 p.m. Eastern Time

RSVP and submit a question for the President.

[nic]

Aug 19, 2009 8:34:40 GMT -5 el Gusano said:

Aug 19, 2009 7:14:30 GMT -5 Justin Thyme said:

Basic health care is available for everyone in the US right now through existing government programs or existing private programs. There is no reason at all for your sick kids not seeing a doctor. Tell me what state and county you are talking about and I'll find the services for you.

Quit trying to protect individual freedoms you capitalist pig!

I wonder if these poor, poor people have cable TV, eat out, etc.?

Or do they sit home and watch the grass grow, throw rocks at each other (I'm sure they can't afford balls), and have nothing but homegrown beans to eat and water to drink?

I don't know. One specific example I was thinking of (from Hamilton County) the lad wore the same dirty, unironed clothes every day. I'm not sure he was lording it up at Olive Garden every Friday Night.

Anyway, now I'm in Georgia, teaching. I appreciate that there are programs available to give people living around the poverty line free health care, and I'm sure people who don't make use of this are, well, maybe trying to stay under the radar, or are making poor choices.

Maybe I was thinking of other cases. Cases where the single parent family can have health care through an employer, but that visit costs $30 (or whatever) and that kinda money just isn't readily available in a weekly budget, so its a case of, knuckle down, if its still bad in a week, we'll go.

I don't know.

As most people have pointed out, most people, including me, don't know what's on the bill, they just don't want to end up like Canada/Russia/Egypt.

There msut surely be pro's and con's with any system, and both sides seem to be more focused on finding the con's of the opponents, than the pro's of themselves. Such is politics, I guess.

[rstewart]

Aug 20, 2009 4:39:42 GMT -5 nic said:

As most people have pointed out, most people, including me, don't know what's on the bill, they just don't want to end up like Canada/Russia/Egypt.

EXACTLY! This is where B. Hussien Obama has showm himself to be an abject failure as a leader. He has yet to articulate his vision for health reform. He yada, yada, yada's at these town hall meeting but doesn't provide any details. I want SPECIFIC details, not bullshit about we're going to get 2/3 of the $1 Trillion from savings. OK, fine, EXACTLY what savings. I want SPECIFIC details on where there is waste in the system. Let us cut the waste our BEFORE we re-invent the wheel. If after ALL waste that can be curtailed we still need reform then let us address it at that time. Call me a cynic but it's a con job. It there is waste in the system, fix the waste and then re-evaluate the needs. It's sort of like a bankrupt guy who has a car but doesn't like the car because the A/C doesn't work. Is he going to fix the A/C or buy a new Benz? My guess is fix the A/C. However what is being pushed by our so-called leaders would throw away the car with the bad A/C and buy a Lamborghini. Which would be fine if he weren't bankrupt as America is.

[Justin Thyme]

The bill is written so that no one would want to read it. Take one of the long novels that you wanted to read but was intimidated by its size and you'll have the length of the bill. Now consider reading an insurance policy of that length. Most people can't even get through a ten page policy that they are buying much less a thousand page policy.

But if you are inclined to read it you can find a PDF of it here

[el Gusano]

Aug 20, 2009 4:39:42 GMT -5 nic said:

but that visit costs $30 (or whatever) and that kinda money just isn't readily available in a weekly budget

That $30 copay keeps people from using it frivolously. The kibbutzes are a good example of that. When everything was free, people didn't take care of stuff: They would leave lights on, bring friends to eat, etc., and expect the producers to pay for it all. So, they started charging for these things, and guess what? People started being more responsible.

It's kind of like a buffet: If you don't pay for your second helping, you're much more likely to get it, but if you're really hungry, you'll pay for it at a restaurant.

[osrb]

I am all for heath care reform if it includes tort reform and punishments for those abuse the system.

[daworm]

I personally don't think it is as broken as people think. Compared to even 50 years ago, it is night and day better now. And for those who "can't afford" health insurance, I'd be willing to bet a very large portion of them can't afford it because of either a) bad decisions they are making right now, or b) bad decisions they or their parents made in the past. I don't think we should reward bad decisions with freebies.

[dysnomia]

Universal health insurance is all about taking care of the pent up demand of the 45 million Americans with out.
preventive care with out copays for the low wage worker or unemployed means that these people would not clog the public or non profit hospital with there $300,000 + bills as they die.And thats after they have lost there homes and property to under insured medical costs.

Ask the so called nonprofit Blue cross/Blue shield on top of of Cameron hill how much of the premium dollar goes to that vast army of employees who sit in judgment of who's claim will be denied( it is 18%!)
all non profits must divulge there annual tax returns to the public.................ask blue shield for theres....................go ahead try it!

[LimitedRecourse]

Not having "health insurance" does NOT mean you are without "health care." Equating the two is less than honest.

[BlackFox]

Also, equating "health care" with emergency room care is less than honest.

[LimitedRecourse]

Who did that? There are free clinics, city & state-run care (Google "health department") along with doctors/nurses who donate services w/companies that donate medicines. All that on top of FREE emergency room care can hardly be considered "without health care."

[Justin Thyme]

Just because I'm sure someone here needs this information.

www.vim-chatt.org/default.asp

[daworm]

preventive care with out copays for the low wage worker or unemployed means that these people would not clog the public or non profit hospital with there $300,000 + bills as they die.

And whose fault is it that 45 million people can't afford health care? Mine? Not hardly.

[Justin Thyme]

Aug 21, 2009 16:37:30 GMT -5 daworm said:

preventive care with out copays for the low wage worker or unemployed means that these people would not clog the public or non profit hospital with there $300,000 + bills as they die.

And whose fault is it that 45 million people can't afford health care? Mine? Not hardly.

The figures I've seen (I will try to locate the source later and share it) are that 45 million are without health insurance and of those 45 million:

15 Million could qualify for insurance they can afford but have chosen not to.
15 Million qualify for some program somewhere that will take care of them when they are ill but since they aren't ill they show up as uninsured.
15 Million do not qualify for any existing program that will allow them to purchase affordable insurance.

So out of over 300 million people in this nation 5% can't afford health insurance.

5%! Do we really have a crisis?

[LimitedRecourse]

There is no "crisis" except that Obama can't get any legislation passed or any of his hair-brained schemes to make any headway among the American citizens.