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Post by apriled on Mar 19, 2012 17:54:35 GMT -5
Don't let the tent hit ya..... Commssioner Henry and the Sheriff did something right today. Goodbye, Occupiers. Thank you Sheriff Hammond for protecting the taxpayer funded property at the Hamilton County Courthouse by removing the tents. The beautiful and historic courthouse lawn was ruined. The courthouse lawn has always been a centerpiece for downtown Chattanooga. The pink flowers and tulips are simply breathtaking in the spring. While I appreciate the Occupiers right to protest and to be heard, their rights stop when they damage public property. The Courthouse lawn was not designed to have open burning barrels, and be covered with tents. This is Chris Brooks very well done interview with Commissioner Henry today, I like this. www.youtube.com/watch?v=4t7LGItxONs&feature=player_embedded |
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Post by Half-Tard on Mar 19, 2012 18:13:19 GMT -5
Goodbye Freedom of speech and the right to assemble. Thank your local republicant. Another right taken away by the party of no and party of a womens vagina is public property.
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JC
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Post by JC on Mar 19, 2012 19:05:10 GMT -5
Goodbye Freedom of speech and the right to assemble. Thank your local republicant. Another right taken away by the party of no and party of a womens vagina is public property. ...Just don't camp out on that vag! |
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Post by apriled on Mar 20, 2012 8:36:53 GMT -5
Aceman, "party of no and party of a women's vagina is public." That is so funny.
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Post by Half-Tard on Mar 20, 2012 9:50:52 GMT -5
Like they say if the shoe fits. Please register your vagina at the Clerk Of courts A.S.A.P., GOP wants to have a national data base of all Vagina's in case one shows up at the clinic.
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Post by exccinsider on Mar 20, 2012 10:07:09 GMT -5
I'm glad to see those losers go.
1st amendment does not guarantee the right to camp on the courthouse lawn for free and trash the place. I have no problem with standing there and holding signs, just like the "shame on..." union guys do. But the camping and fire pits and stuff is just outrageous.
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Post by justme on Mar 21, 2012 8:40:02 GMT -5
As one of the 99%, I am irritated with many of the things that appear to be a part of the Occupy movement. That said, I'm not certain what impact "they" (all inclusive for local Occupiers) think camping on the Courthouse lawn was supposed to make. Did/do they think it was a convenient location to congregate to spread a message? Did/do they think that somehow County authorities/County employees could have some sort of impact? Or, is it even more simple - do they think that the mere act of protesting is irritating to some people and therefore they can claim a successful protest if they know they've been an irritant? (If that's the case, they can certainly claim success).
I really don't know the answers to these questions. From looking at their Facebook site, it certainly appears that they feel they have accomplished something by getting kicked off the lawn. While they may feel personally proud of this "accomplishment," I fail to see how it moves them further toward any goals they may have.
To use one but issue, I seriously doubt that anyone who has any ability to raise the issue of Corporate Personhood in the appropriate forum took any notice whatsoever that a group of 12 or so tents (and 5 or so people in a county with a population of 336,000) and various belongings were peacefully moved off the county courthouse lawn and onto the sidewalk some 20 feet or so away in Chattanooga, TN.
To use the current terminology, I am one of the 99% that the Occupy movement claims to represent. Here is how I am "represented" in the local movement. Given a population of 336,000 (and no, I haven't +/- for the accounting of babies, illegals, not counted, deceased etc., etc. Nor have I accounted for the people in the protest who ARE NOT Hamilton County residents), with a representation of 5 people at the site, that equates the .0015% of the population of Hamilton County interested enough to participate. With a representation of 50 people on site (which, I think is very generous), that equates to .015% of the population of Hamilton interested enough to participate. Regardless of the reasons, which may include too busy (personally I'm working 2 jobs, going to school [comments on another issue - paying my own way with cash, not taking out loans, etc. - I foolishly took them for my undergrad work and paid them back many years ago], volunteer at my daughter's school, help with her homework, and am active in my church), does not understand the movement, are active in other ways to effect change, are interested enough to gripe, but not do anything (including camping), or simply don't care. They claim to represent the 99%, but I think that their representation is mainly in their own minds. They do not represent me in that I believe that the best way to effect change is to DO SOMETHING, not just gripe about it. I haven't seen any evidence of any DOING, only public griping (aka protesting).
Regardless of who they represent (or think they represent), their First Amendment rights have not been violated in any shape, form or fashion. They have the right to protest and the County has not made any attempt to stop them from protesting, at any time, day or night.
I'm not sure what the big deal about not being allowed to camp. It appears to me they have rotating protesters anyway, why do they need to camp? To me it seems the only difference is that they are not now allowed certain comforts as a part of their protest. As a general rule, I don't think that effecting change exists in a comfort zone (of any degree - standing vs. sitting, sitting outside vs. inside, out in the elements vs. tent, tent vs. house, etc., etc., etc.). The County may have infringed on their comforts, not a constitutionally-protected right, by the way, by have not violated anyone's rights to free speech.
What the County has finally said is that neither the Occupy movement nor other group or individual has the right to park their ass on the grass by using the Courthouse grounds as a campsite.
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osrb
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Post by osrb on Mar 21, 2012 9:21:10 GMT -5
Goodbye Freedom of speech and the right to assemble. Thank your local republicant. Another right taken away by the party of no and party of a womens vagina is public property. What a bunch of B.S. this in no way infringes on their freedom of speech. Now if you want something that does you can just look at your hero Obama for that. When Obama signed into law the Federal Restricted Buildings and Grounds Improvement Act of 2011 he just shit on the Constitution. |
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Post by compspeed on Mar 21, 2012 12:04:01 GMT -5
"When Obama signed into law the Federal Restricted Buildings and Grounds Improvement Act of 2011 he just shit on the Constitution. "
Lest we forget this passed this Senate on a voice vote and the House with a 388 to 3 margin before it was sent to the White House. That being the case it appears there were many more bowel movements before it got to 1600 PA Ave.
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BlackFox
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Post by BlackFox on Mar 21, 2012 12:32:42 GMT -5
Remember, when it's bad, it's Obama's fault. When it's good, it's the republican congress.
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osrb
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Post by osrb on Mar 21, 2012 12:47:37 GMT -5
Remember, when it's bad, it's Obama's fault. When it's good, it's the republican congress. Nope the Libertarians. |
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Post by Tsavodiner on Mar 21, 2012 16:08:29 GMT -5
Sign me up as being represented by this paragraph.
NOTHING in the Constitution protects destruction of property as "speech".
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Post by pictureman on Mar 21, 2012 17:07:14 GMT -5
Thanks alot for tearing up "my" lawn, you fargin' bastiches. Now, pack up your crap and get out while I pay to clean up and repair your "Freedom of Speech".
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JC
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Post by JC on Mar 21, 2012 17:53:38 GMT -5
I have supported the OM since they began several months ago. I'm far from being a socialist or against capitalism.
I too have dreams of being rich and will continue to drive for that.
But, I would love to see big business give up the greed. The greed that keeps hard working employees in poverty. The greed that sends jobs over seas. The greed that has become government sponsored with bailouts, handouts and favorable legislations. And of course, the greed that sponsors corrupt politicians.
But, the OM nationwide has become an ineffective mess and filled with bums, criminals and crackheads just looking for a free meal.
In Chattanooga, the OM seems to be nothing more then a homeless camp.
I say good riddance. Maybe one day the OM can actually organize with intelligent, hard working people and form an interest group that can make changes.
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BlackFox
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Post by BlackFox on Mar 21, 2012 19:16:30 GMT -5
They should be occupying Washington, DC. The source of the problem. All this local shit is just, well, what JC said.
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Post by apriled on Mar 22, 2012 21:35:19 GMT -5
BlackFox, you consistently make sense to me.
Chattanooga is not the Mecca of Wall Street, and the County and City cannot effect any reform Nationally. The Occupiers need bus tickets.
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Post by el Gusano on Mar 22, 2012 22:52:09 GMT -5
How about the greed that raises taxes to the point that moving overseas is more lucrative?
Or the greed of the unions that drive up costs to the point that moving overseas is more lucrative?
And if the bailouts stopped, executives would be on the hook for running the companies better, but the bailouts started in the 1920's as a precursor to the Great Depression, and considering where we are now headed...
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Post by wheels on Mar 23, 2012 8:09:01 GMT -5
How about the greed that raises taxes to the point that moving overseas is more lucrative? Or the greed of the unions that drive up costs to the point that moving overseas is more lucrative? or the greed of the american consumer... demanding the lowest prices possible. there's a reason american companies move offshore. the cost of doing business is just lower. as long as americans are willing to accept cheap junk that doesn't last made in factories with no OSHA, EPA or any other regulation, companies will continue to move offshore or purchase from foreign companies. |
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JC
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Post by JC on Mar 23, 2012 13:33:28 GMT -5
Yup, how dare employees of rich businesses ask for a livable wage and benefits.
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osrb
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Post by osrb on Mar 23, 2012 14:18:13 GMT -5
Yup, how dare employees of rich businesses ask for a livable wage and benefits. How dare the shareholders of companies demand a return on their investment? |
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Post by JC on Mar 23, 2012 16:50:28 GMT -5
Yup, how dare employees of rich businesses ask for a livable wage and benefits. How dare the shareholders of companies demand a return on their investment? Maybe you misunderstood me. I have never said that they do not deserve to make a profit or even become wealthy. If you reread what I originally said, you'll see that I said that I too dream of becoming rich... and last time I checked, there's only two ways to do that. One is working capitalism in your favor and the other is the lottery. Crime and whoring excluded. But, let's break this down in a non-rocket surgeon way and list the reasons businesses go over seas. 1) The US worker demands a livable wage and benefits. 2) The US consumer demands low prices. 3) The US government demands businesses provide save working environments. 4) Business owners/stock holders/investors demand maximum profits. At current, businesses have decided to cut the first three in order to increase the 4th. Now, lets break down which ones we can cut or can not cut to brings jobs back to the US. 1) The US worker is not going to work for Chinese/Mexican wages. If forced to, we would see a mass increase in class separation and a collapse in our economy. History teaches us that those in poverty will only break their backs for the rich for so long before revolting. For the latter, current times shows us that when people can not afford to buy things, the economy collapses. 2) The US consumer will not pay 2x+ the price for an American made product. And let's be real here, this isn't the '80s anymore. Chinese made products (for the most part) today are every bit as good as American made products. And in some cases, better. Who here would rather have an American made electronic device over one made in China or Japan? 3) The US government will not ever relax on business regulations and safety. 4) Businesses paying owners//heads/investors 7+ figures whilst still being able to turn multimillion dollar profits can afford to cut those numbers inorder to bring jobs back to this shore. Again. I am not saying they do not deserve to make a profit or be wealthy (there obviously has to be some separation in class, else who would flip our burgers) .... but what would it hurt for them to take a reduction in their millions for our economy's good? |
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Post by ssmynkint on Mar 23, 2012 20:18:34 GMT -5
Unfortunately, #3 is up for grabs in the brainwashed minds of the American electorate and their corporate/oligarchic masters.
#4 presumes some sense of genuine good will, or an ideal of fairness, both sorely lacking in the Rightest, includeing Libertarians who seem to distain the notion of "fairness" as much as Skinner distained the notion of "mind".
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Post by el Gusano on Mar 24, 2012 0:12:48 GMT -5
1) The US worker demands a livable wage and benefits. And then some. Some are never happy, but are unwilling to start their own business to compete. They would rather use monopoly power enforced by government guns to twist arms which hurts everyone. An economy is like water in that it will find its own level. Competition, not force, will determine wages and benefits. 2) The US consumer demands low prices. As they well should. Competition benefits everyone. 3) The US government demands businesses provide save working environments. That idea went out the window decades ago. The government demands that businesses bow down to government demands. (Reading "The Death of Common Sense" will give you an idea of where we were years ago, and things have only gotten worse.) One example that I observed personally was that a company was fined a few thousand dollars because their MSDS book was 6 inches from where government regulations demanded that it be placed. The company had to wall up a door and make a new door a few inches away. How did that make the company safer? OSHA put a brick maker out of business because after a string of expensive and pointless demands, the safety rail was 1/2" an inch too short, so government demands said the company had to dig up all the concrete and replace the entire rail. The company decided to simply close. How did that make the business safer? So-called government safety regulations have become the stick, since the carrot was destroyed long ago. 4) Business owners/stock holders/investors demand maximum profits. As they should. And the government takes a big chunk of it away from them to redistribute to others who made poorer choices in life. What is wrong with an athlete making $80million, as long as fans are willing to pay him that much? 1) The US worker is not going to work for Chinese/Mexican wages. If forced to, we would see a mass increase in class separation and a collapse in our economy. History teaches us that those in poverty will only break their backs for the rich for so long before revolting. For the latter, current times shows us that when people can not afford to buy things, the economy collapses. Read "The Wal-Mart Effect" for a realistic look at this concept, instead of the knee-jerk MSM emotionalism. An economy will find its own level. 2) The US consumer will not pay 2x+ the price for an American made product. And let's be real here, this isn't the '80s anymore. Chinese made products (for the most part) today are every bit as good as American made products. And in some cases, better. Who here would rather have an American made electronic device over one made in China or Japan? What made their products better? Are we incapable of making a better product? No. Government protections kept companies from having to improve while protecting them from foreign competitors. Worked really well in sending us into the Great Depression and the depression of the 70s and is well on its way into sending us into the next one. GM can build a 'Vette that has tons of horsepower, handles great, and gets good gas mileage. Problem is, it's unaffordable to most people, and when people do get them, things break and fall off, such as the seat belt holders and door buttons. (I read a review in a European magazine that started out with stars in their eyes and ended up with them making fun of US made cars.) Why has the Corolla been the most long term reliable car until the industry changed the meaning of "long term" and made door switches equal to blown engines? 3) The US government will not ever relax on business regulations and safety. If we could simply get them back to safety regulations, that would remove a great burden from companies wanting to do business here. 4) Businesses paying owners//heads/investors 7+ figures whilst still being able to turn multimillion dollar profits can afford to cut those numbers inorder to bring jobs back to this shore. How about cutting taxes and quit punishing them when they are successful? How about removing the government monopoly on employees? (Union free Toyota employees are happier than GM/UAW employees.) Again. I am not saying they do not deserve to make a profit or be wealthy (there obviously has to be some separation in class, else who would flip our burgers) .... but what would it hurt for them to take a reduction in their millions for our economy's good? Remove the government protection (bailouts) and they would either earn their money or would not make as much. Instead of demanding a paycut, demand the government quit protecting them from failure. But, free trade always benefits everyone. If an Englishman could produce one yard of cloth in four hours and a bushel of potatoes in one hour, while an Irishman took twelve hours to make the cloth and two hours to harvest the potatoes, trade would still benefit both, even though the Englishman is more efficient at both. He is three times more efficient at making cloth and twice as efficient in farming potatoes. But, the Englishman is MORE cost efficient in making cloth. If he didn't make the cloth, he can harvest four bushels of potatoes. When the Irishman didn't make the cloth, he could get six bushels of potatoes. If they were to trade potatoes for cloth at the rate of one yard of cloth for five bushels of potatoes, both would benefit. If the Englishman made only cloth and the Irishman only picked potatoes, the Englishman would get five bushels of potatoes for a yard of cloth instead of the four bushels he would have harvested. The Irishman would get a yard of cloth for only five bushels of potatoes. It's the same with anything between any two trading partners, as long as the government stays out of the way. It's government interference that is the problem, not people wanting to keep what they have earned. |
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JC
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Post by JC on Mar 24, 2012 0:50:10 GMT -5
^^^ Synopsis: It's the government's fault. Far as this goes "Competition, not force, will determine wages and benefits." Sophistry. In a perfect world, what you say is correct. Unfortunately, people are forced to work for whatever they can get. But, don't fret, folks. Gus and the rest of the Conservatives will have us up to par with the Chinese economy with their "competitive wages" and safer working environments in no time!   |
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Post by el Gusano on Mar 24, 2012 10:19:37 GMT -5
And yet, the more heavily libertarian areas of our own nation have much better economies than the ones with more government influence.
Just a fluke, I'm sure.
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Post by Half-Tard on Mar 24, 2012 10:28:32 GMT -5
LINK?
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Post by el Gusano on Mar 24, 2012 12:54:58 GMT -5
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Post by Half-Tard on Mar 24, 2012 13:17:20 GMT -5
quit making up stories Gus, I think you're better than that?
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Post by el Gusano on Mar 24, 2012 16:06:53 GMT -5
Didn't bother looking I see.
How about the worst cities in the nation? The vast majority of those are very heavily unionized with government force to keep the monopolies. Detroit is a liberal paradise.
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Post by Half-Tard on Mar 24, 2012 17:51:18 GMT -5
I asked you for a link to back up that laughable claim. You gave me a homework assignment with the cost of living calculator. Nothing to do with your claim. Cost of living is different everywhere in the USA. South is cheap, New York is exspensive. Hawaii is outrageous. It's about location not economic policies of different states.
Then you throw up something we all know Detroit, has more to do with, decline of sales american made auto's. The steel business moving to china.
GO BUCKEYES BEAT THE ORANGEMAN
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